Last year, when discussing the French Revolution, one of the questions posed was whether, two centuries after the Declaration of the Rights of Man and Citizen, we could still say that we are really free.
What's your opinion on this issue?
Working with values through folktales
12 years ago
13 comments:
The other day I rented a film called 'Zeitgeist'. Frankly speaking, I am so absorved in my duties that I did not know of the existence of such a film. Part I explains that the monetary system creates money from nothing, printing mere papers or bonds whose support are, in reality, people's loan payments. So, provided that people pay their loans, this money turn then in a system of new loans for other people. However, if one declares in bunkruptcy or default, then the bank is in its own right of confiscating the property, for people remain, according to this film, enslaved of a monerary system based on perpetual debt regulated by parameters such as interest and inflation. Part II of the film, goes on explaining that the same mechanism exists for emergent nations needing for loans. Thus, the monetary system has their finantial institutions which provide these nations in economical risk with loans which are likewise hard to be paid. But, these loans are used by industrial corporations, private foreign enterprices, etc, instead of being used for people welfare. On the contrary, all that is left to people is a hard external debt to be paid. In this sense, Chomsky explains, in one of his articles, that profits are shared just by a few, whereas debts are shared by everybody. Finally, the film starts with an interesting quotation:
'None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free' (Johann Wolfgang Von Goethe)
It may sound naive to answer that after the Declaration of the Rights of Man and Citizen men(and women, of course) are free. Where are they really free? What kind of man and citizen could be considered as free? The French Revolution encouraged extreme individualism for the "private citizens" , the bourgeoise, and they represent the "modern feudalism". Positivism as dogma, Liberalism as privilege and Capitalism as "divine right" seem to show us that everything is similar to the so called "Old Regime".On July 14th, 1789 a different kind of "monarch" was born: "Lord Bourgeois". And through the ages "La Bastilla" became the White
House".
With regard to Nestor's point of view, I absolutely agree with the messaje that he wanted to leave quoting the main idea of the plot of the movie, Zeitgeist. Now I'd like to see it!( What is the meaning of that word)? Is it any symbol?).
I think we are free in the sense that we can do what we want, work in the job we want, go to places we want, get access to services and supplies we need. Now what Nestor said about loans and all that, well if you get involved in a debt, you are still free but at the same time attached to a debt that you have to pay no matter what. Debts are debts.If you cannot pay them, don't ask for them.
I totally agree with you Robert. For another thing, I also think of freedom in the sense of freedom of expression. We are free to the extent to which we can express freely. Even our representatives can exercise their power, when freedom is granted, discussing issues of importance like the law of radiodifusion, which at last would put an end to mass media monopoly in Argentina. Disgracefully, some other countries does not enjoy of the same benefits granted in our democratic nation. Take the case of Nicaragua whose democratic president Mel Zelaya, elected by the 90 % of people, has been overthrown by militars for asking people if a second re-election would or not be appropriate. Even in the past, the 17th Century French peasants witnessed some sort of freedom restriction that affected their survival since the nobility controlled and possessed the arable lands and preferred the gayties of Paris rather than working the countryfields. In addition, ordinary French people were also subject of the abuses from monopolies created to secure jobs for the wealthier families and controlling the labour market. Possibly, these and other events, which had a gesture of freedom restriction, must have derived to the French revolution by those times.
I agree with you Nestor,the most important point to consider is the freedom we as citizens have to express our ideas.If we are free to do so, then,we can live freely and do whatever we want of course taking into account that there are some regulations to follow.I think that we are really free now,after having fought many time for our rights.However,If I consider Cuba now and the limited regulations for citizens,I can say that they are not really free at all.As Nestor says these restrictive freedom in some places of the world,surely have derived from the previous times of the french revolution when people were opressed by the nobility.
Totally agree with you Flavia. Opression seemed to have existed in France by the 18th century, thing which must have led to the events of the French revolution. At the end of this, the three Jackobites leaders of that revolt would be captured and some of them beheaded. Afterwards, a group of ex members of the parliament called 'The Moderates',who were indignated by the bloodshed and the trials organized by the revolutioneers to accuse or even condenm the oppositors to the revolution to death, restored the situation to a normal way and things recovered a balance. Many important rights were granted to people but likewise there was a restoration of that old order existing before the French Revolution.
I think that freedom has to do with education. It has to do with the possibility of choosing what you want to do/believe. The problem comes when you do not know the options, you do not know that there are other things to choose from ( religion,ideologies,ideas in general)So your scope of posibilities is very narrow or maybe you do not have more that one option ( I´m thinking about those poeple who recieve " planes sociales") That's why I think that without education we are not free.
I absolutely agree with Yesica with the idea that without education the scopes of possibilities are reduced in life and we are likewise not free. By the way, all this reminds me of a book I read last year called 'Pedagogy of the Opressed' written by Paulo Freyre. This author understands education as a liberating process and proposes a change of the class dynamism. Basically, he believes that students can be exposed to an oppressive classroom situation whenever their opinions are not heard, when creativity is diminished, there's no participation, when students are just mere receptors of information like 'stores', when they just receive and store information without being taken into account so much their interests, their ideas. Freyre summarizes all these aspects is an idea known as 'the Banking' concept. Opposed to the banking theory, Paulo believes that such an oppressive atmosphere can be reverted, and refers to a concept known as 'problem posing' that favours critical thinking, awakening in the student the sense of investigation in clasroom, the use of dialogics as an alternative to antidialogics- the latter is negative and oppressive since it divides, rules and manipulates. In sum, Freyre refers that the finality of oppresion is in essence to control whereas liberation seeks for the self achievement and completion.
Yes, Jesi!! I completely agree with you. Freedom is totally related with education, opinions, way of thinking. It is in this way that people can reflect upon everything around them.
I agree with Robert, I think that be free has to do with choosing whatever we want such as, job, palces to go and so on but it is also important, as Flavia said that freedom has to do with expressing our ideas in a freely way
Reading your comments, I agree with those who argue that freedom of thought and freedom to express our ideas are some of the most important things that human beings have. So I consider that we, as free citizens, have the tools for changing what is wrong or what we do not like as regards politics or economy and one of these tools is the "vote". Futhermore, with proper education we may be aware of that we have rights and that they have to be defended.
I'm newbie here, I hope to get friends at this forum
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